Does prayer work??

[Hollow Cost]

So ive been reading a book called "The God Delusion" written by R. Dawkins. The book mentions a double blind experiment funded by religious activist.

heres a quote from Live Science commenting on the experiment.

NEW YORK (AP)—In the largest study of its kind, researchers found that having people pray for heart bypass surgery patients had no effect on their recovery. In fact, patients who knew they were being prayed for had a slightly higher rate of complications.

Researchers emphasized that their work can't address whether God exists or answers prayers made on another's behalf. The study can only look for an effect from prayers offered as part of the research, they said.

They also said they had no explanation for the higher complication rate in patients who knew they were being prayed for, in comparison to patients who only knew it was possible prayers were being said for them.

Critics said the question of God's reaction to prayers simply can't be explored by scientific study.

In the intervening nine years, while we awaited the results from this unprecedented mother of all prayer experiments, other prayer experiments surfaced:


•A 1997 experiment on “Intercessory Prayer in the Treatment of Alcohol Abuse and Dependence” found no measurable effect of intercessory prayer.

•A 1998 experiment with arthritis patients reported that no significant effect from distant prayer was found.

•A 1999 study of 990 coronary care patients—who were unaware of the study—reported about 10 percent fewer complications for the half who received prayers “for a speedy recovery with no complications.” But there was no difference in specific major complications such as cardiac arrest, hypertension and pneumonia, with the median hospital stay the same 4.0 days for both groups.

•A 2001 Mayo Clinic study of 799 coronary care patients offered a simple result: “As delivered in this study, intercessory prayer had no significant effect on medical outcomes,” the study said.

•A 2005 Duke University study of 848 coronary patients found no significant difference in clinical outcomes between those prayed for and those not.

as far as the double blind study, religious followers dismissed the results and said that "God" could see through the experiment, and that "God" only answers prayers for good reasons. The results concluded that there is no correlation between physical conditons and prayer. So i would like to hear what you all have to say about all of this.

[StitchiZ]

No comment

[Hollow Cost]

lol y not fam?? im tryna get a conversation started lol

[El Heisenberg]

if prayer worked less people would have died in time such as the bubonic plague.. humans are dumb.

[StitchiZ]

I get told off for commentin on these type of threads

[Toobs]

you can shit in one hand, and pray in the other...

see which on fills up first...

[Rule.]

i believe, and know, that it works. but i can only speak on behalf of my own life and through the testimony and sharing that others have told me.

as for all the technicalities/motivations/ethical-ness of this 'experiment' i dont have enough knowledge/understanding of the Bible, yet, to properly discern.

but i do know that God looks at the heart, and where humans might view their motives as pure, that doesnt necessarily mean it's pure in God's eyes.

but lol i know this convo gunna get off track real fast, but this was interesting enough.

[Toobs]

ive never been a very religious person whatsoever....
and dont believe in god, nor rule out its existence.... ive never prayed on any type of normal basis, but when i was a kid i was forced to go to church for a few years....
i never did get Optimus Prime or Megatron....god was cheap in those days....
i also never recieved my 20" Robinson SST with bulldog breaks, back wheel pegs and a gyro gooseneck....
cheap....god was cheap...

i can say, that at 2 very low points of desperation in my life after solidifying my own beliefs, i said fuck it and tried prayer....had no idea who i was talking to but i did it anyway....


nothing happened....

[StitchiZ]

[YOUTUBE]LvM-6iiCFcw[/YOUTUBE]

[Toobs]

lmao@the prayer amplifier!!!

[Extinctor Draconis]

only works if wear this

[Spoken Deity]

Prayer, is a hard thing to understand and is def a tension in my religion. If we are to say prayer works, then we must say that God will act based on our hopes for righteous goodwill... if we say we believe in a personal God but that prayer does not work, then we are indeed at odds with various religious texts (or the one you have trust in).

The studies posted here, which are kind of old news, pretty much give us 3 strong possibilities for interpretation:
1) prayer does not work
2) prayer cannot be measured
3) the experiment misunderstands prayer

I honestly don't know what to do about prayer. I tend to prayer the Lords prayer and the Apostles creed... thats about it.

the issue with these experiments and their interpretation:
People assume that these experiments totally debunk God. The don't at all. You've got to understand that cartesian structures of knowledge are avoided in todays world... the support for a religion or God in general lies in a web. So if you show there is some tension with prayer, fine. But you haven't touched on numerous other parts of the discussion- early history, the texts, ontology, epistemology... There is a lot more to discuss before one looks at prayer and decides god is dead.

[Spoken Deity]

I get told off for commentin on these type of threads

you were told off because of your attitude rather than the substance of your comments.

As a woman once said, "its not what you said, it's how you said it."
Here is an example-

"I believe atheism to be the most honest interpretation of the world, considering all the data I have received."

and then

"religious people are fucking stupid, don't understand science and haven't a fucking clue what's going on... if you're not an atheist or agnostic, you're probably an idiot."

[Letterman]

It does work. People need to understand that you can't just pray for ANYTHING you want and expect to just receive it. It doesn't work that way. But people are gonna believe what they wanna believe and this is more of an opinion based question...people are gonna post what they think!

[abiona]

They also said they had no explanation for the higher complication rate in patients who knew they were being prayed for, in comparison to patients who only knew it was possible prayers were being said for them.

This has nothing to do with whether or not "God" answers prayers and everything to do with the power of suggestion and the psychosomatic effects that the suggestion of prayer has on people.